[00:00:06] Speaker A: Welcome to from caving in to crushing it, the podcast for those who find themselves immersed in adversity and choose to write their story instead of having others write it for them. I'm Drew Deraney, and I'm your host.
[00:00:21] Speaker B: Hey, Michael, it's good to see you.
[00:00:23] Speaker C: Hey, good to see you two, man. How you doing?
[00:00:25] Speaker B: Doing well. Thank you. So, I always like to thank the person who introduced us, and I know that I don't want to mess up her last name, but it's Pooja Archanopoly, and she introduced us, and we have to thank pooja for doing that. So I wanted to make sure I acknowledge that there's always a reason why people introduce people. And I think you and I picked up on the why when we had our first time. We talked, which is one of the reasons why I wanted you on the show.
I'm all about making it aware to people that quite often we are living somebody else's belief system just the way we were brought up.
And in life, life is not linear, and we're taught that it is right. You do a, b, and c and d, and then e is going to happen, and it doesn't happen now.
And not everybody realizes when a defining moment occurs in their life, and often they don't realize they have a choice. Now, you just stick with the old stuff or create your own reality. And I know you created your own reality when you met your defining moment, and that's why I wanted you on, if you could, for the audience, think back as far as you'd like and to pinpoint that defining moment where something grabbed you, and you realize, hey, Michael, there's a better way to live, and I'm going to start doing something different.
You share that with. Appreciate it.
[00:02:09] Speaker C: Well, bro, I don't have to think too hard about this, actually. So the thing that really grabbed me happened in 2012, happened around July 2012, and the story is that I found a lump, and it ended up being cancerous. And just the way things fell into place during that time, it was like other people's appointments got canceled so I can get in to visit the doctor. Other people had consultations that they were like, well, we just happen to have a spot for you. It's like things just fell into place so rapidly for me to find out that, yeah, this lump is actually a tumor, and it needs to be removed. And cancer is one of those things where we know it happens, we know that statistically, there's a high likelihood each of us are going to get it at some time. In our lives. But it always seems like an over there that's a problem that happens to other people or it happens to old people. And it's like I'm 32 years old or however old I was back then. I can't math fast enough. It's late in the day, I'm x number of years old. It's like I'm too young for this. And the defining moment for me was right when I received the call from our doctor. Because I went to visit the doctor, he felt around, and he's like, oh, yeah, that's a problem. And then he sent me off to get an ultrasound done, got the ultrasound taken care of. That same day, he called me on my phone and he said, well, we got the results back and it is a tumor. And he said, it's going to have to be surgically removed. It's all I know right now. He said, but I have a referral for you. I want you to get in touch with this person and he'll take care of you. And when I got off the call, my wife Charlote, was standing right behind me. She's actually, I know this is an audio show, but there's a dresser right back here. I happened to be standing at that very dresser when I got the call. And I turned around and she was right there. And I said, that was the doctor. And he said, it is, in fact, a tumor. And there was just this beat where we realized we are entering a new chapter of our lives. And Charlote's mom had had colon cancer. I didn't have colon cancer. It was testicular.
Side note, guys, if you're going to get a cancer, like, that's the best kind to get. Just saying it's easy.
So cancer had touched our family in a couple ways. And so to hear that directed at me, she was like, okay, I guess we're doing this.
It was the start of a really rough time, but it was a time in my life where this is probably going to sound weird. I would not trade it for anything, even knowing, like, there was dark spots that I went through mentally, physically, spiritually. I would not give that up because it absolutely changed who I am at a foundational level. As a man, as a husband, as a father, as a Christian, as a business owner, as an employee. It's like everything just got busted up. It's like busting up the foundation of a house and be like, start over. And I'm a different guy. It kind of scares me to think who I'd be had this not happened, what kind of person would I be?
[00:05:49] Speaker B: And so here I am, something that will knock you to your core at the time.
You don't want it to happen. You wish it didn't happen. When you get through it, you become stronger and different person. It's amazing how your mindset shifts and you're thankful you went through it because it made you stronger. It's interesting how that human mind works that way. I do understand why, yeah.
So after you got through it, was the process getting through all that a challenge, the processes that they wanted you to go through, do you have a different approach you wanted to do? Were you in line and aligned with the thoughts of the doctors and what they wanted to do?
[00:06:36] Speaker C: Well, I mean, that process was fairly straightforward. So in the grander scheme of things, I got off without having to do nearly as much as what you normally think of when you hear a cancer diagnosis. I didn't have to have chemo. I didn't have to have radiation. It was a surgery, and it was done. I'd go back every month at first to get blood work and scans and x rays and things like that. They're like, we're just making sure, we're just super making sure that it's not anywhere. But the prognosis was excellent. And actually, that kind of cancer has a higher than 99% cure rate. By cure. They just cut one of your balls off, and then it's like, problem solved. Remove the cancer. Remove the problem. Right. But they would explain that, hey, when we look at where the cut was made under a microscope, if we don't see cancer cells smashed up against the incision, then they call it a negative margin. They said it's more than a millimeter away, which isn't much. But when you're talking about cells, it's like, that's like a mile. They're a mile away from there. It's like there are no cancer cells anywhere else. You're most likely, statistically probably fine, right? But we're just going through the motions, man.
I do think back on this, because it is a formative time in my life. It definitely was scary. It definitely was scary because every month you have this reminder that, oh, hey, you had cancer that one time, and so now we're going to go back, and maybe it's back. Maybe it went somewhere else. Who knows? I mean, there was always that kind of drumbeat of fear in the back of my mind. Right.
Well, when you said the original question, you said, did you disagree with the doctors at any point?
At first, no. But later on, like three years in, I was like, you know what? We've been doing this for long enough. I'm tired of the angst. I'm tired of constantly, every time they space it out, after a while, it's once every three months and then once every six months and then once every year. And I'm like, I'm tired of getting myself worked up about this. This is not good for me. It always turns out okay. I have no doubt things are fine. I told the oncologist, I said, listen, you're doing great, but this isn't working for me. The stress is actually doing damage. I feel.
So I'm just going to step back. He tried to convince me to keep coming. He said, we got to go for the entire seven. Like, no, I'm sorry, I'm not.
Yeah, exactly. And I mean, by that time, my wife, Charlote and I, we had made massive wholesale one. We're probably going to get to this in a little bit. But that's one of the things that led us down the path of better nutrition, clean eating, but also better putting stuff on ourselves. Right? Like, holy moly, you'd never believe the amount of toxins that are in off the shelf deodorant, of all things. Who thinks about their armpits on a regular basis? Well, we do, but, yeah, I mean, that's one of the things.
It was a heck of a journey, dude. It was a heck of a journey.
[00:09:54] Speaker B: You got to be intrigued about the deodorants. Make sure the one I use is all right.
You wouldn't think that, though. But you know what? Who knows what they. I mean, you can read the ingredients. If you can't pronounce them, it's probably not a good thing to use.
[00:10:07] Speaker C: Yeah, even the ones you can pronounce sometimes. I mean, if it's got aluminum in it, it's like. That's usually for antiperspirant. But then it's like, ask the question, why is it bad to sweat?
[00:10:19] Speaker B: Agree with you.
It's natural to sweat. And they release some toxins. Why would you want to keep that stuff in?
[00:10:26] Speaker C: It's a good point. Exactly.
[00:10:28] Speaker B: Anti.
So once you got through that, what were you doing professionally at that time? And did that change? Did you find a different purpose in life professionally?
[00:10:41] Speaker C: I sure did, man. And one thing that I realized probably after the fact was I had a job where I was in a very high stress environment. A lot of type A personalities. Not faulting the company by saying that, but what I am saying, it's kind of foreshadowing to the fact that I previously was not emotionally mature. And I'm saying this as I was in my 30s, right? And I can say I'm not emotionally mature. Like, what? You're a man, aren't you? Well, yeah, but doesn't mean I understand that not everybody's out to get me. It doesn't mean that I've got enough self confidence that I'm not worried about losing my job. I could never enjoy vacations until I was three days in and fully relaxed, because I was always afraid I'm going to come back to work, and there's going to be, like, somebody else sitting at my desk, like, what the heck?
But looking back, it's like, the big change that happened was I launched myself in a direction of less stability, less security as it comes to how I make money. And so I went from making a pretty good salary. I was making, like, 65,000. But this is way before COVID This is, like, the early 2000s, right?
Making that kind of money and saying, okay, well, I need a job. I need a different job. And the first one that came up was a contracting position, and everybody was like, contracting is scary. They can fire you anytime. Hey, newsflash. They can fire you anytime, even if you're a w two employee. Just saying, right? Job security is a myth. You heard it here first.
And so when I started doing that, and I went from that job to one where it was consulting and then another one where I had executed on an idea of starting an LLC and just doing the same thing I was doing for a whole career and just doing more stuff and cutting ties with the idea of, I can't take risk. Risk is scary. Failure sucks. Failure defines me as a person. I define myself as a failure. I stopped doing that. I realized I'm like, I'm not a failure just because I failed. Failure is an event. It's not a definition.
It led me down this path of, it's okay to have this, I'm running with scissors feeling right. It's okay to run downhill. It's perfectly fine. In fact, if you're not taking a moderate amount of risk on a regular basis, you're really doing yourself a disservice by not testing your limitations.
Now I'm just woo all the time.
[00:13:32] Speaker A: So tell me, what was one of the first risks you took, and you didn't look back?
[00:13:40] Speaker C: Well, it was getting married.
And this is, like, way before cancer. This is like BC, right? So we got married in 2007. So if BC is before cancer, it's five BC. Married a grand total of five years, and then got the big c, man.
But, yeah, I mean, as a kid growing up, I almost had it bred into me to be a little bit risk averse. Like, always seek after stability, make sure that you have all the information in front of you before you make a decision. Right? And so I'd had a string of failed relationships, dating relationships, varying lengths. Like, before I met Charlotte, the longest relationship I ever had was, like, three and a half years. And it was kind of weird, but it was very out of character for me to make this decision. We actually got set up. We met on May the fourth, 2007. All right. And good friend Aaron and his wife Rachel set us up, and they said, you know, charlote's single. Michael's single. What about Michael and Charlote? Let's hatch a plant and make something happen.
And fell right into it. Fell right into the trap, bro. But here's the thing. Here's the thing, and this is what really was my first crazy, risky decision, is I told my friend Aaron, I said, listen, I know your job, what you do for a living. You have to be an excellent read of people. You have to know how people relate to each other. You got to know how to communicate. I said, I cannot pick a good relationship to save my life. I have a string of failures behind me, and I know I'm a creature of habit. I said, here's the thing. If you think you and Charlote. If you think me and Charlote would be a good fit, you're probably right. And so I'm going to propose to her. Like, I'm going to ask her dad first, but I'm going to propose to her, right? And we were married five months later, man. We met on May the fourth.
[00:15:38] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:15:38] Speaker C: 2007. We got married on October 6, that same year.
[00:15:42] Speaker B: I love that.
[00:15:43] Speaker C: Nuts, man.
[00:15:45] Speaker A: Birthday. I'm October.
[00:15:46] Speaker C: Did you.
[00:15:47] Speaker A: My birthday. Thank you for getting married on my birthday.
[00:15:49] Speaker C: Beautiful. Now, you know. See, if I had had enough foresight, I would have gotten married on somebody's birthday, so I'd have one less date to remember. Mine. Hers, something like that.
[00:15:58] Speaker B: Right?
[00:15:59] Speaker A: So my birthday. Now you'll remember. Okay.
[00:16:01] Speaker C: There we. Hey, happy, happy Drew's birthday. She'll be like, who's Drew?
[00:16:04] Speaker A: Who's Drew? Yes. Let me play this podcast for you.
[00:16:08] Speaker C: Yeah, listen to it.
[00:16:09] Speaker A: That's awesome. I love that. I love that story and the fact that you trusted Aaron and his judge of character. Sometimes we have to just throw our lives up to a higher power instead of trying to control it. So good job.
Okay, so we went through the marriage.
You beat the cancer. Now you decided not to stay in the corporate world, and you're going to do your own thing. What was your own thing, and how does it help shape you where you are right now?
[00:16:38] Speaker C: Well, my own thing was a company that I fired up in 2015 called Arch DevOps. And so its premise was basically, keep doing the same thing you were doing in your career, which was software testing and automation. Right. So they would call me and they would say, we got a sticky problem. Let's call in the fritz. And so my best clients were the ones that were larger corporations that are making software for their clients. Software has to be tested before you give it to the clients, usually. And that testing process takes a long time, and it would be better if it's automated. We're doing the same things every single time. Let's just write a program that clicks the buttons, fills in the fields, selects from the drop downs, looks at the screen and says, yes, we got it. And then I would come in and I would do that for them. But then I would also teach their testers how to do it because I wanted to work myself out of a job every time I got a client.
I don't want you guys being dependent on me. Right. Because there's only one of me, right? And it grew into a company where I had two employees and an intern at 1.4 of us. Like the A Team. It was great.
I'm like, hannibal, right?
You get that reference, right? Have you seen the show a team?
[00:17:57] Speaker A: I was going to call you Mr. T, but you do. Mr. T. Your last name.
[00:18:01] Speaker C: I pity the fool. Well, I don't really have the right build to be.
We did have a black guy, though, and he would have fit because he was built like a fire hydrant. I'm like, I should have.
[00:18:14] Speaker A: Okay, well, we'll stick with you being Hannibal. When a plan comes together.
[00:18:18] Speaker C: Yeah, I love it when a plan comes together. But, yeah, that was that first company. I actually shut that company down in early 2021. Oh, really?
[00:18:29] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:18:30] Speaker C: Yeah, it shut down. I know. I still use the email address. I just use it because I like the calendar. Okay. But, yeah, now I've got two companies. The first is a full service podcasting agency. And that podcasting process was actually something. I kind of stapled it onto arch DevOps. I was, like, putting.
Adding services. I'm like, we got to keep it afloat. Oh, my goodness. And that was one of them. And I just pulled that out into its own thing. And it's like, yeah, wonder of wonders, people are paying me money for that. So I guess I did the right.
Yeah. And then the other business was one. So I had mentioned before, like, Charlote and I started making our own deodorant and bug spray and stuff. Right?
[00:19:12] Speaker B: Clean stuff.
[00:19:12] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, I tell people, I'm like, we got pestered into starting that business called exactly zero. And we had so many people that were like, wow, you make your own lip balm, you make your own sunscreen. Have you guys thought about starting a business? They were asking, right? And then it kind of evolved into they were telling us to start a business. They were like, make a business. The world needs what you're making, and I'm going to buy some of it. They're like, shut up and take my money. And we're like, okay.
It's like we started an etsy. I mean, if people are going to throw money at you in exchange for the thing that you were going to do anyway, yes. You might as well make a business. Right? No brainer. But that's been what you built it.
[00:19:54] Speaker A: On Etsy, you said.
[00:19:55] Speaker C: Yeah, originally we moved off of Etsy not because they increased their percentages or anything, but because we're doing wholesale, we're doing affiliate, we're doing subscriptions. You can't really do that stuff, right? So you can't do that on Etsy. Yeah.
[00:20:10] Speaker A: Good for you.
[00:20:11] Speaker C: It's fun, man.
[00:20:12] Speaker A: All right. Do those two businesses ever collide? Do you have a podcast on eating clean?
[00:20:18] Speaker C: Yeah, we do.
They don't collide in like, two alpha rams are like, bang.
They play together. Right.
[00:20:28] Speaker A: They don't argue, but yeah, they complement each other. Absolutely.
[00:20:31] Speaker C: Yeah. One supports the other. And it's cool, too, because previously, when inevitably everybody that you meet is like, so what do you do for a living? And it's like, I used to be able to say, well, I do software test automation. That's super nerdy. Okay. The only people that are going to be like, I get that, are like, Ctos, CIOs, right. But now I can explain. I do this and I do this, and without fail, people will gravitate toward one or the other. They think, wow. On the whole, this is a really cool, like, you do both things. But then they want to talk podcasting or they want to talk about clean lifestyle, and it's like, good. Now we've got to choose your own adventure. Next time we meet, we can talk about the other one.
[00:21:12] Speaker A: Yeah, that's wonderful. Tell me about the podcast. Agency, what do you consider involved in a full service for the people who don't know anything about podcasting?
[00:21:25] Speaker C: Okay, well, if you're listening to this, they know a little bit about podcasting.
[00:21:28] Speaker A: Podcast to listen to, but that's, they.
[00:21:29] Speaker C: Know how to find it. They can listen to it.
They can come away. They can listen to a show and come away having been enriched in some way. Maybe they're going to hear about somebody's story like we're doing. Maybe they're going to learn some cool things, right? But this is the tip of the iceberg. Everything else that goes on behind the scenes. How do you find a guest? How do you get them to apply? What's the vetting process? How do they schedule once you have the show, how do you edit it? How do you publish it? What do you do to promote it? What do you do to keep the communication going with the guests? How do you find more guests? Right? Like, all of that stuff is part of the ecosystem, and that's just the podcast piece. There's also an area around it. Like, well, once you've had a guest on your show, how do you want them to take part in your ecosystem? Do you want them to join a mailing list? Do you want them to sign up for a course, buy a book, attend a workshop, go to an event, be an affiliate, like, whatever it is. Buy some swag, buy a branded coffee mug or a t shirt or a hat, right? All of these things are all part of that podcasting ecosystem. We do all of that. So every person we work with ends up that they've got a particular goal in mind. They're like, hey, I got a business.
I want to use this as a way to generate leads. It absolutely can do that when you build a podcast the right way. But the main thing is I maybe could tell people that this is what I do in the podcasting space is it's relationships as a service.
It's building relationships, giving you a mechanism to build relationships in a hurry with the right people. We happen to use podcasting as a way to do that. So the podcast is actually a tool in the toolbox. The main thing that we're building is a relationship engine.
I should rebrand. Maybe I should do that. Maybe I should put that in my LinkedIn somewhere and be like, I like that.
[00:23:19] Speaker A: You better patent that and take that for yourself.
[00:23:22] Speaker C: Patents are expensive, man. Llcs are much cheaper.
[00:23:25] Speaker A: Just write the little TM above it and trade.
[00:23:27] Speaker C: There we go. Nobody's going to check that out.
[00:23:30] Speaker A: Just paste it on there yeah, so many people do that. So that's interesting you say that because when you have the guest on, you have to record it and then you distribute it. I'm sure a lot of podcasters don't think of that next step of keeping their guests in their ecosystem.
And it makes sense, too. You're building a relationship, and having a conversation like this just builds a relationship stronger.
I'm sure people, I have reasons why I pick certain guests to be on. So you'd want those people to be in your ecosystem.
That's a very helpful tip.
Tell me a little about the clean living, how that platform works, and that little bit about that.
[00:24:24] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, as far as the platform itself, it's an ecom store, it's a website spilt in WordPress. You can go buy anything that we make right now. We have more than 60 products. We have all kinds of bar soap. We have shampoo bars, hair serum, sunscreen, bug spray, anti itch stick if you forget to use the bug spray, all kinds of lip balms every year.
It's getting to be about pumpkin spice time pretty soon here. So we're going to have that and body butter. This is not the time of the year for that. You won't see it listed because it melts in the summer.
[00:24:55] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:24:57] Speaker C: That deodorant lotion bars we've gotten into as well. Some fun stuff like bath teas, bath salts. And then we've also got a line of products that we're starting out with for the dog space. So we've got lotion for dogs, dog paws, they get crunchy, too. And it's like somebody came to us with an idea and we're like, well, we could do that. Just make an unscented lotion bar and put it in a tin, right? Rub the dog's feet in there. Problem solved. So we got our first order today, actually. There's somebody in the canine space, and she's like, yeah, so we're making it. Got a business, but, yeah, thank you. We're at different events. We go to markets, like farmers markets every other week, one off events. Turns out that the yarn and the knitting community, the crocheting community, loves our stuff. Like, we didn't know how big it would be in that sector.
The holistic places, any kind of coaches that are into nutrition, they like our stuff. Spas, salons, yoga studios, chiropractors. We're all over the place, and it's like we're spreading and it's bigger. When we started, I don't know if I mentioned this before, but when we started, we had three kinds of soap and three kinds of lip balm, and now it's like we're almost a household name. We see our products in different places, and it's like, yo, we made that because it says exactly zero. Our house smells like everything, man. I wish you could smell it. It smells.
[00:26:27] Speaker A: Love it. Well, can you invent being able to smell through a computer during a podcast? Maybe there's maybe. Think about that. Bring it that.
[00:26:35] Speaker C: Not on Zoom. Actually, I think Zoom came out with a plugin not too long ago. But you got to put a USB port up your nose, the corners. It's always an engineering thing, right?
[00:26:48] Speaker A: Too much like a COVID test. Sticking a USB thing up your.
[00:26:51] Speaker C: That's too far if you go that far.
[00:26:53] Speaker B: That's true.
[00:26:54] Speaker A: Yeah, you don't do that.
[00:26:55] Speaker C: You just got to go this far.
[00:26:56] Speaker A: Man, so we could talk about every topic. Look forward to whoever. Talk about USB ports up the nose. Don't do that at home.
[00:27:02] Speaker C: Don't do that.
[00:27:03] Speaker A: Dangerous.
[00:27:03] Speaker C: No, do not try this at home.
[00:27:05] Speaker A: Don't try this at home. All right, so I know we could probably keep talking.
I have two questions to ask you before we let the audience know how they can reach you. So you're sitting down with seven to ten year old Michael, and you want to give him advice about life. What are you going to tell him?
[00:27:26] Speaker C: I'm going to tell seven to ten year old Michael that the best things in life to do are going to feel scary. And it's okay to be scared. That's how courage is made, is when you know what you need to do and you're scared and you just do it anyway. All right.
Thinking back to that time in my life, it was kind of a fog. I mean, a lot of kids these days seem to have just a.
There's a quietness about them just because they aren't quite sure what to make of the world. They don't know yet how to interact with it. And I found in my own life, it resulted in me not stepping out. I did not know how to communicate. I didn't know how to human properly. I know how to talk now, obviously, but before, I would be like. I would have been a terrible podcast guest when I was seven. Right.
But these days, it's like, no, a big part of the reason why I know how to interact with the world is because I took those scary steps toward doing public speaking, toward taking risk, toward starting a business, toward saying, I think I know about myself and I'm going to step out and try some crazy. And it works out. It works out. So you can take tremendously more risk in life and you'll be fine. Right, little Fritz?
[00:28:46] Speaker A: Yes. Very good advice to little Fritz. All right, so I'm going to put a different hat on. And now you're sitting with young Michael, the young entrepreneur, young businessman, and you want to give him advice about business. What are you going to tell him, dude?
[00:29:00] Speaker C: Do not tie your personal identity to the business. Beautiful. Do not do that. Arch DevOps is an LLC that you paid $51.25 to the state of Missouri to have. It's a checking account. It's a website. It's not you. If Arch DevOps fails, it doesn't mean you are a failure. A failure is an event. This is fresh in my mind, bro, because I just talked about this literally an hour ago to somebody else, and I didn't know you were going to ask this question.
It doesn't mean you suck. It means you tried something. You had the bravery to step out and take risk, and you said, I have a theory. If I do this, this is going to happen. And that theory didn't pan out. It doesn't mean you're stupid. It means you did the best you could with what you've got. Keep a light touch on business. A business is just a revenue generator. It doesn't mean anything about you as a person. Actually, if somebody wants to take that failure and project that on you as, look at this guy. He tried something and he failed. Ha ha. It's like, well, that says more about that person than it does about you. Probably indicates that person doesn't need to be in your life anymore. Right? So that's the big thing. Now. I will say, too, I don't wish that I can go back and change that.
The stuff that I learned, I had to learn the things the hard way. But then if you learn it, it's like, well, now I can project that to the world. If I can go back and change it, I probably wouldn't be a guest on your show because I would have figured that out and been like, yeah, everything's good, man.
[00:30:37] Speaker A: Absolutely.
That's wonderful advice. Too often, especially men, we tie our self identity to our profession. And when you relinquish control of your self identity to something you don't have control over, that's a recipe for disaster. So thanks for giving that advice to young Fritz.
Okay, so the audience has gotten to understand the essence of Mike frituce. How'd I do?
[00:31:06] Speaker C: You did good. You got the accent. It's Fritzus. You got the accent on Fritz. There we go.
[00:31:12] Speaker A: Fritz.
[00:31:15] Speaker C: I forget where you're from. What state are you in?
[00:31:17] Speaker A: New Jersey.
[00:31:18] Speaker C: You got cardinals up there?
[00:31:20] Speaker A: The red birds. Yeah.
[00:31:22] Speaker C: So listen to them. And when they chirp, they go, Fritz, Fritz. Like that.
[00:31:27] Speaker A: That's how I've heard that.
[00:31:28] Speaker B: There we go.
[00:31:30] Speaker C: They're Fritz birds.
[00:31:31] Speaker A: Interesting. Okay, good, then that's helpful. Tell the audience how easy it is to get a hold of you.
[00:31:39] Speaker C: Oh, my goodness. It is so easy to get a hold of me. We have an email address. We also have a website. I'll direct the listeners to our website for the clean, lifestyle stuff. It's exactly zero. All one word.
Well, two words, but smash them together. There's no dash.
[00:32:00] Speaker A: It's just exactly zero. Not the number zero.
[00:32:03] Speaker C: Yeah, the word. The word. Zero. The word. Exactly. The word zero.
[00:32:07] Speaker A: Good.
[00:32:09] Speaker C: And we're on there. So you can reach out to us via contact form if you want to reach out to us directly. It's just exactly
[email protected]. So fam, short for family. Yeah. We're really easy to get a hold of and we'd love to hear from.
[00:32:23] Speaker A: Wonderful, wonderful. Well, Michael, thanks for coming into my life and being on the show, my friend. I'm thankful that we were introduced to each other, and this will not be the last time we talk.
[00:32:33] Speaker C: Well, good. I hope not, because you're a chill dude.
[00:32:36] Speaker A: Yeah, and I think you're a chill dude.
Going to keep. We're going to keep up that relationship, man. Hey, thanks again. And keep doing what you're doing. Michael. You have a couple awesome services that are of value to the community, so keep it up.
[00:32:48] Speaker C: I will do, man. Thank you.
[00:32:50] Speaker A: All right. Take care. Take care, everybody.
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